Unknown Speaker thing happens. Oh my goodness, I had a very American voice telling me recording in progress. Like my wife is in the room. Fantastic. Can I see your name is organic publicity on it? Can I just check? Because we do. I'll jump out of this now. Well, I'll stop the video and go on mute so you guys can just chat. Alright, I wasn't sure because normally when we when Peter puts on the video, it's the him and the interviewee side by side. Yes, there will be there will be that I will leave you will not have me in your frame. If you don't mind at the end, we'll just cover you up with pictures from Emma's illustrious career. Don't mind money editing? Okay, fantastic. So first of all, thank you very much for joining me. Unknown Speaker Very welcome. Unknown Speaker Thank you. I just before we get into the interview proper. The general structure that I have for podcasts and videos and so on, is that first of all, ask you very easy questions. Very broad, open questions about who you are, where you're from, and how you how you got involved. And then as it develops, I'll ask you more and more specific questions. And, again, please do guide the conversation. The more you talk, Unknown Speaker is it like Thomas or Unknown Speaker this is not live, this is editable? If you for example, if you start on an answer, yeah, and you're, you're not too happy, you can just stop and then go again. It helps audio recording enormously. If you do just give a pause for a few seconds. Okay, what if I asked you a project and you say, oh, you know what? That was ages ago? I can't remember. That's okay. We are totally set up. Unknown Speaker Because, yeah, because I'm quite good at tangent thinking my head. Unknown Speaker So we so we say focus, of course is on the latest project, and anything you might have coming up, I'd love to bring in some of your, your career. Because obviously, you know, it's it's all you Unknown Speaker doing it while it doesn't feel that long, actually. It's a bit crazy, really. But yeah, I feel like I have got quite a quirky background of how I came into it. And sort of my first beginnings in London actually really quite interesting. Unknown Speaker I understand. So if you don't mind, I'll start a little get straight to it. You're happy. Okay, fantastic. So first of all, Emma, thank you very, very much for joining us on from Taylor's club. It's wonderful to have you here. Unknown Speaker You're very welcome. It's really it's a pleasure. It's just lovely to come on. Thank you. Unknown Speaker Thank you. Your latest project is Lady chatters Lee. Lady Chatterley's. How do I say the name? I'm Unknown Speaker sorry. Chatterley's Lover. Unknown Speaker Thank you very much. I've never been tongue twisters. It's a very exciting project from Netflix, can you tell me about your involvement with it? Unknown Speaker So my, I was invited to come aboard as a costume designer, which is a truly great job. And on this project, I think it was it was a joyous job, actually, in terms of sort of styling, designing, building the wardrobe for the main characters in terms of Eric Emma car and who plays Connie, it was it we really did, we had, you know, it's it's very much a collaborative journey that you go on with any actor, in terms of sort of, I mean, initially, as a costume designer, you receive a script. And I was, I was think as the the first read of any script is really important in regards to sort of the journey you go on, in respect to designing the costumes for that project. And you can read a script at the beginning, I think you sort of start building pictures in your head. And sometimes those pictures don't stay with you, once you start prepping it or sometimes, hopefully, those gut feelings and initial thoughts really do actually a pivotal to the design of a project. But yeah, we started it what it really was just a great journey with Emma and Jack and at the beginning, once sort of you've I've read the script, then I go off and I've got, I always have a little bit of time at the beginning on my own before the rest of my team jump on board. So it's sort of a lovely, quiet time to actually do sort of reference for the period. I ended up in, certainly in contemporary shops because there's definitely a sort of there were there was a sense of having the film having a sort of modern element in the styling and having a timeless setting which is, which was a conversation I had very early on with law, the director. And then I started building mood boards, and looks for the different characters. And that's that can be from visiting art galleries, for sure we're still in the world. You know, we're in a world where the Portrait Gallery sits with beautiful paintings of this period, which is the most you know, it's such a great organic way of referencing and still sort of actually seeing fabrics and textures in paintings. I, as I said, I took myself to places like Selfridges, and Harvey Nichols, because I really wanted to bring an element of modern day clothing into this film. So I did start buying actual sort of pieces of clothing from certain fashion brands, I took myself to the costume houses, I dip my heads into still I have a lot of reference books at home, and I still love books, and will always dip back into sort of books for referencing and just photographic reference as well. And then you start sort of building a wardrobe together for the character. And then Emma came in for a fitting sort of, she came in, I can't remember how many fittings we had, actually, we had a few fittings, because we certainly had, some of her costume was built and tailored for her. So we had to have her back once we actually started making. But initially, she came in and tried on a real mix of period clothing from the costume house, as I said, some clothing from from actual fashion shops in London. And we just fell in love with what we were doing for this character. Because I think we felt the close was still sort of period appropriate, but had a loose and casual feel. And certainly closer even today, you would have fun, enjoy wearing and still, you know, want to wear to Glastonbury festival or great night out. Unknown Speaker And I find that your concept changed very much. You said that sometimes you read the script, and sometimes it will change as it goes forward. I'm wondering what kind of changes happened in this process? Unknown Speaker I actually, I really feel in, in this process it my mood board stay true to the questions that Connie ended up wearing. And that's what I was always so excited about, I think about this project. Because once those boards were you can use, sometimes you can go on it, you have a gut feeling, and then you have to go full circle to come back to it before you realize it was the best thought that you had. But you have to explore other avenues before you then come back to that first feeling. Or potentially you can, you know, I bring my thoughts to a fitting in terms of the character and I've pulled costume for the character and then an actor will come in and obviously they have we are building this person together. We're finding clothes for this case. So it is character driven. And we're together we have to find out who Connie is why she's wearing that dress. What's she going to wear when she goes to rugby. We have all the seasonal changes through the script, which sort of dictated differences in color palette. It did weights of fabric. So, but I think our thoughts were really aligned, actually. And we were really, we were both. As I said, we were both truly excited about building the costume for for this character. And we and we loved the clothes that we were putting together for her but they were definitely clothes that we felt were were right for who this person is. Unknown Speaker I'm very interested that you mentioned the weight of the fabric because you said you're drawing from contemporary classic sources. And the weight of every Sunday has changed enormously in the film. It looks right. Was that something that you were very concerned about? Is? Unknown Speaker Definitely yeah, it was very driven by the script on a certain level because we start off in the autumn. And we're very much in London. So there was a sort of sense of it being stylish London, then when when her and when Connie and Clifford arrive at Rugby. It's still it's it's winter. They've arrived at this really stuffy old house that nobody's lived in for a while. And I feel I wanted apart. I wanted that to be reflected in the weight and heaviness of her suiting. But equally the fabric that I chose for that arrival. Costume is still more of a contemporary tweed than a tweed that sits within sort of the period. And then the layers really, when she starts having her affair with melas, it says case that sort of, in terms of kind of freedom and expression and just to her opening up, then definitely I wanted the fabric weights to completely change. But again, that's quite in line with the seasonal changes in the squid because when we go into spring and summer. So, I mean, there was a sort of dead certainly we go into delicate laces and floral hints and almost fabric that's disappears. And it's almost part of a skin, if that makes sense in terms of then the whole affair and the relationship. But that was, it was definitely a sort of conscious decision to do that and to make those changes and for her to go on this journey. And then we're in Venice, we go to Venice. And that was a whole completely different world because I wanted, I mean, Venice and rugby and the miners. I mean, suddenly, I mean, we're in this kind of like amazing, chic, elegant place good Venice. And we're in sort of soft linens. And so, so I wanted to just sit well in Venice, but equally, still be different. And so she's sort of her color palette was very green, and Emerald, and she still is carrying this whole wonderful kind of Bohemian feel about her wardrobe. Unknown Speaker There's so many elements around that as the actors input, your inputs, there's the historicity, there's the story. And of course, you have the director's view as well. It's there's a lot of moving parts to this. Unknown Speaker There are lots of moving parts, and there's Yeah, and then we've got the whales, the countryside of wild Wales as a backdrop to the whole movie, which is, which was a very interesting sort of element that you have to always consider because you know, you aren't, you are, you're working with the color of the nature around you. And certainly the color palette of the dresses and the costume. And to how that sits within the sort of Welsh countryside was something that was also discussed. It was discussed quite a lot with Ben while the DOP in regard to Connie, and melas and all his blues and where we were going with with his color palette. So So yeah, there is you're right, there's, there's lots of different like a big jigsaw puzzle, that you're building a jigsaw puzzle, and you're really wanting all the pieces to actually sit, sit in the right place. And it all comes together as a beautiful kind of painting at the end. Actually, each friend he wants to be this beautiful painting somehow. Unknown Speaker Absolutely. Because of course we have all the individual characters and they have their place within the cast of characters. And there's very much an overall feel for this. Because I asked specifically for the menswear. Is this something that's a passion of yours because they really stand out on screen the different fellas on the screen. Unknown Speaker I really love I love actually I do. Yeah, I do love it menswear actually, as well. And I think and certainly we had a great tailor who cut for sick Clifford and just choosing the fabrics for his suiting was really you know, was really really enjoyed choosing fabrics for his suiting in terms of melas I really didn't want to go down that sort of world of brown and he ended up in there was a sort of sense of almost French work were actually in his clothing. And and yeah, and the Henley and it like a chore jacket. Which even which now you know all guys so many guys, it's sort of you know, the end, it's still in shops now and he's been there for decades. And the fabrics, I wanted the fabrics to still have again a sort of a real, more of a sort of contemporary feel about them. But there's little details like the lining on the back of a waistcoat or the linings in the lining inside his jacket, just his little scarf that he wears. That was so there were just little elements that definitely were very much more of today clothing that you kind of see in Shoreditch now you know that but still is you know work where clothing exists now as it did then the fabrics have changed for sure and and go you know guys absolutely love wearing it it's sort of you know it's it's very much in I'm very near lands conduit Street and it's very much in place in the lovely shops like Oliver Spencer down the road now. Unknown Speaker I was wondering if I wanted to go and find myself a Henley like that. Trousers like that. Are you drawing from shops that Unknown Speaker I think the handle is actually Thomas So now to get the right one we did you know, it's mad you do the button, making sure the buttons are the buttons that you want. Or maybe you have to change the buttons in regard and just the sleeve and the cuff and, and just yeah we did with and whether it's ribbed or whether it's just plain. So there's all the little details that sort of go into the final choice of of any sort of garment or piece of clothing that somebody does end up wearing. Unknown Speaker People and I have talked before quite a bit about how the buttons and zips can date things enormously to a specific era, a specific place, often the costume designers will swap out buttons or try and hide certain aspects, were you adapting this clothing a lot, were you able to find it as you wanted. Unknown Speaker It was a mix, because some of the costume has to still have original pieces from the period. But then there may not be in a condition that you would you could actually use. So you might want to try it on an actor and just look at it because it is a beautiful, original piece. And then you may I'm sure you would want to recut it and change it. And then then then it is really is in regard to sort of choice of fabric, are you going to choose a fabric that sort of dictates that we are still very much in the period? Or are we using a contemporary fabric that then is throwing us sort of keeping us in the period but then slightly, sort of bringing it into a sort of modern, more modern day setting? It was it was I guess it was it was a real mix in terms of still, I think starting off a project, you still want to be rooted. You want to do your references and research first, and then you start turning or twisting. It's a really interesting period. Yeah, because a lot happens. You've got you know, the suffragette movement, it was a big change in women's clothing, then you've got obviously, you know, so Clifford goes off to war, and then you've got women's clothing is women are wearing men's clothing because working in factories. So so the it's quite it becomes quite military, the sort of it's got a less rigid feel. The tailoring is gone a little bit it's the corsets have gone it's a lot looser than the skirt that was going up. So it's it's I think, as a decade, in terms of kind of women's clothing. It's it's really, it's really interesting, actually, and and I did want to sort of have a sense of that in the film for sure. I think he'll does he, some of the characters stay along with your nine others via Rasul? Some, really, Unknown Speaker it's an area you've dealt with before in your career, right? And so for example, I think you'd watch on a TV show. That was about Ian Fleming bond maker. Oh, my Unknown Speaker gosh, that's a that's a great ghost that's done your research. Unknown Speaker We know, we know. Something a long Unknown Speaker time ago. That was a very long, that was a long project. Actually. Unknown Speaker I had a very idiosyncratic dress sense. So I was wondering if you're looking at a very idiosyncratic individual in a period of history. Unknown Speaker Yeah, yeah. I mean, wow. Okay. Yeah, I did do that job. Unknown Speaker Was wondering if this kind of relates if you're able to draw on those experiences? Unknown Speaker That seems I mean, it's, it's, it's a long time ago, that job? I remember it? Well, I do remember it well, and it was a great job. It was one of those. Yeah, it was the wonderful world of BBC Three with Fannie kradic. And all those I did, you know, when they did one, one and a half hours, sort of, of these films, and we had great, great scripts, and we had great cars. And I think we had, we literally had three weeks prep Unknown Speaker around here. Yeah. We were able to draw on a lot of, there's a lot of evidence and research and knowledge about but again, he was very individual. Were you able to be creative in that? Or? Unknown Speaker Yeah, because you're still definitely in terms of in terms of some you know, it's a real person, isn't it? So you're still finding, you're not literally it's finding the essence of who that person is still. And I think, you know, I do feel you still can be creative, and he dressed? Well, I mean, he was, you know, he was a stylish, he was a stylish man of his time. So I feel, I do feel I was able to be creative, although, I'm trying to remember exactly what I do. Remember, there were, I think we went to be because there were lots of party events. And there were lots of party scenes. So it was yeah, it was. I have very fond memories of those projects. Actually. I really do. Yeah. Unknown Speaker And I'm wondering, you know, We have we have looked at your career starting out, I believe with styles episode one. Is this is this right? In with the wardrobe department? Unknown Speaker Yeah, so I did. I actually did a, an art degree in three dimensional design wood, metal and plastics. I came to London having made a corset in metal which I well I'm amazing headdresses. And I was wondering what I was going to do in my career. And I'd always, I had always wanted to costume and set design is sort of slightly been talked out about came to London, amazingly, had been in touch with a man called Martin Adams who makes costume props. And I worked there for a few months and ever was making headdresses and drove the film, little Buddha, actually, oh, and then I wandered around with my portfolio, met some amazing people. Actually, Isabella Blow, had a look at my portfolio in vogue and tried to get my corset into vogue, an article she was doing and bow wow, I met liberi with my portfolio, amazingly. And then out of me, meeting all these people actually ended up getting myself that job at the Royal Opera House. For two, I think I was about tune in the headdress and jewelry department, but still with this sense of it. And I just been introduced to somebody who was working on that first job I mentioned had just come from an amazing costume and set design course called mockbee. And I left in the end, a wonderful costume designer called Maria Beyonce, and who comes from who designed Phantom of the Opera kept telling me you will never be a costume designer if you stay at the Opera House. And I left Motley, or I left the opera house to then do the costume and set is going corset mockbee, which was an amazing cause from the lady who was still running. It was in her late 80s, early 90s. I was here 30 doesn't exist anymore. I left there and one of my first jobs was actually working in the work for him on Star Wars, which was amazing. And then I went on my course it ended up on a touring exhibition for a year called unlaced grace with a Vivienne Westwood corset, a corset from these amazing leather people could Whittaker Malan and at the end of the exhibition, the lady who put it together, it was it was, I think it must have ended up at bhambri Museum in Oxfordshire. And they bought three they ended up buying three corsets, which I have no idea whether it's still in bhambri museum, but it actually bought me my first ever car so yeah, yeah, it was it was Yeah, so it did buy me my first car that the the corset, but yes, Phantom. I mean, that was the Phantom Menace, it was, I think none of us could believe that there would be more Star Wars, really, when we were and I remember the excitement of being on that project with somehow. And then I had amazingly, I had met Sandy Powell, before I'd gone back to college. And I ended up in the following January on Shakespeare in Love, which was an incredible experience actually. So Unknown Speaker you know, another fantastic experience another fantastic addition to your CV, good experience for us all to enjoy and watch. I was wondering Of course, with these junior projects, you're you're looking at to say Trisha, bigger, the costume designer and so on, if you worked closely with him, and if that's influenced the way that you work with your team? Unknown Speaker Um, I think any once you move into the industry, any you learn every project, you'll learn something new. And you'll learn you know, you certainly, I mean, it was just to have worked. I mean, Maria, Beyonce and took me actually to an Opera Festival in Italy as her assistant. So that was before I left the opera house, and she was an incredible costume designer. She's sadly no longer with us. But she, she was an amazing lady. Certainly, I spent quite a little while sort of on projects with Sandy and she's obviously the most incredible costume designer and to be able to be sort of around somebody like that and just, I think, yeah, you definitely learn learn from your peers and people like that for sure. You know, who were who were at the top of their, the industry, you know, It was a absolute honor to sort of be invited to work on projects with them. But then there's a point where either you, there's many jobs in costume, there's only one costume designer, but there's many other jobs within the costume department that are really important. And the costume designer is no, you know, it's me, it my team, it's not, it's about me and my team, it's not, it's not a project doesn't come together and work brilliantly, unless you have this most amazing team around you. It's, you know, the people that around you, that bring a project together within your department are crucial, and really, really important, actually. But, but in my early career, having the, you know, being invited by people to sort of join them, and work for them definitely has influenced me, and, and then there was a point where I just, I wanted to be a costume. You know, I wanted to, I think I always felt that even at the Opera House, because I was in a department mate, you know, it was a small element of the overall look of something. So you know, and I wanted to actually be the designer who had the say, the, you know, of the overall look of the costume. So, Unknown Speaker absolutely, I know, you are the costume designer for Netflix, headline, headline movie. Wondering if you do give advice to those who are coming through the industry, those who take under your wing, what kind of advice would you pass on to people who are looking to get Unknown Speaker recently, I have actually, Thomas I've done, I've been invited for the last few years into the London College of Fashion. And I've had, I've been able to talk to sort of first year students. I'm about to be a mental as well. So that's, so that's really, really somewhat so that's so I always say, I came into the I mean, I came to London, I haven't I there's no one in my family in the industry, I came to London that I didn't know anyone I don't know, I was quite, I think I was quite self driven in regard to arriving in London, and having a portfolio of work and wanting to show people my work. And I was excited about showing people my work and, and through that all these wonderful opportunities sort of arose. And that's how I ended up amazingly working at the Royal Opera House, which at the beginning of my career was it was the most magical place to work, really, I've never really seen ballet and opera before. So it was truly a great place to start. And in terms of sort of, I do love talking to people, because I think if you're passionate about what you do, and you love what you do, then even it's different now. It's changed. When I left some of the person at the opera house that told me to go and speak to the lady who was running the jewelry and headdress department, I didn't have a mobile phone, I literally ran to the nearest red telephone box and made that phone call. So that was you know, it's very different the mobile phone and email world. But for sure, I just I always like to think if if it's an industry you want to go into and you have a passion for it, there's always that there's definitely a space for anyone and there's always a way in. And it's a most fantastic job to have. It's just every project is different. You know, it's every script is different. Every director is different, every wonderful car, you know, we've I'm very, very fortunate and I and I would like to sort of I was very lucky that I met some great people early on in my career. And I'd love to be able to sort of instill that kind of enthusiasm and in in regard to young people who were thinking about it as a career really. Unknown Speaker Thank you very, very much. I have to say, it's great pleasure for us to view your work. Thank you. If you're if you're interested in hairdressers, you have a fair few installs episode one. Your course it's two. Okay, brilliant. Thank you very much. Unknown Speaker You're welcome, Thomas. It's been great to meet you. All. Okay. Unknown Speaker Thank you. Hope to have you on against. Thank you. Thank you. Bye bye Transcribed by https://otter.ai