PB We'll get into the history of the brand, can you just talk about your role and your, your day to day running of Unknown Speaker the place? Well, basically, I guess, Todd and I work side by side with my dad for about, you know, 30 years, I would guess about right like, he start, he came to this country in 1947. And his first job in America as a Holocaust survivor, was he had a friend working in the old three G factory, here in Brooklyn. And so he started off kind of as a job that he thought would be like, part time jobs, so he could like, learn, go to school at night, learn English, and get set up in America for whatever he was going to actually do as a career. And from carrying bundles from place to place, he gradually, you know, wanting to know about everything happening in the shop, and, and advanced and 30 years later, he was running the factory and all the manufacturing and quality control and production. And he was able to then buy in 1977, from the Goldman brothers, that's when it became more Greenfield clothing stores. And I joined him right out of school out of dental school in about 1981. And, you know, he, his forte was in clothing making not so much in business. And mine was just a student. I wouldn't be like his sounding board as he was making decisions. And, you know, buying the business trying to run it, it started off a little tough at the time in the 70s, it was a very bad environment for business, all his customers that he was working with were having financial troubles, the interest rates were like 22%, they couldn't get paid and ran into difficulties and kind of like, had to rethink like the structure of the business. And about that time is when I came in and kind of like, worked side by side to like, we developed a lot of private label business where we would work for other brands and designers and manufacture clothing for them. And they would then distribute it to retailers, we would also work directly with different stores, and create, you know, mines just specifically for them. So we were very skilled that hand tailored clothing. And we developed all right, I helped develop the computer system at the time where, you know, we could do pattern work on computer where we could modify and change much more quickly than the standard to make new models, new patterns, but all with the idea that they could be constructed in the same way through our hand tailored operations in the shop. So that's how we were able to, to do like a band of outsiders model a rag and bone model model for Neiman Marcus Brooks Brothers model for them. So we were able to make many different patterns. And always like going back through three G's, one of the specialties of our company was, you know, to make custom clothing for individual patterns off of different styles and models, all the time was always a large percentage of the production. So again, we worked with many custom, you know, from Paul Stewart or an Alan Flusser, or, you know, custom shirt shop or custom for Brooks Brothers or, you know, so we were very involved in, you know, working with tailors and sales associates in different locations, how to sell and measure and fit people in custom clothing. And then, to some extent, we reserved that for only friends, friends and family here, like on Saturday mornings. And so and we would try not to sell directly to the consumer, because of our relationships with the retailer over the years. But, you know, most of these retailers, like they really work for themselves is a sad thing to say. But you know, there's a large markup when you sell something to a retailer. And by the end, like they get pressured for lower prices and, you know, ready to wear goods tend to get made in cheaper and cheaper places to enable better margins. So we kind of focused more recently on, you know, dealing with the consumer and making clothing, you know, for a person that we can measure ourselves or with some custom makers that you know, could work within our systems as well. So that's really been our focus, like our skill is how to measure a person and make them you know, it didn't matter like a lot of custom makers have like one look or one pattern or one style that they make, and then they have to make that fit a certain person, so they don't have the flexibility we were used to, it didn't matter if it was Brooks Brothers rag and bone, you know, or 20 other things, we can make different patterns to fit the same person if necessary. And then as we started working more and more like to measure an actor to us is the same as measuring any of our customers, which we do, you know, every day of the week now. And, you know, again, like, Who is the person as opposed to what is the actor playing. So, you know, sometimes we measure the same actor, and he's in two different shows or movies, he's a different person in a different environment with a different a different time, even. So we're able to, you know, focus on the individual needs, aside from just measuring a person and making him clothing, you know, we have the ability to, to make the right clothing for the right person. That even involves their personality, which, you know, we learned a lot of that from working on many of these shows. Unknown Speaker So Jake, before we get into the costuming aspect, I'm just curious about a little more on the day to day. So do you guys not use paper patterns, then is it like you measure and then you go to Unknown Speaker us? So we have so early on, we enabled the computer because, you know, when we first started, we would use all paper patterns. And you know, the cutter would lay out a cloth on the cutting table, pick out the closest size stock pattern. And, you know, then following the custom order, the length alterations, right, low, he stands erect, lower the button, Stan, you know, he would do all those alterations on the table, and create that garment. You know, when I looked at it, you know, it was good, but like, what if you wanted the same suit six months later, or what if you gave it to a different cutter to cut each one had, you know, similar ways of of getting there? And when I got involved with like, a custom design, you know, computerized, you know, cutting system pattern system. So I delved into how do we make a right shoulder low? And, you know, I was surprised that I got, I expected one answer, but I got many answers. But what if it's a plaid, what if it's not a plaid, there's different ways to do it? You know, a simple thing like, Oh, you're going to make the jacket shorter. So what do you do to the waistline of the jacket in shortening a jacket? So and the answer is proportionately you want to raise your short and the jacket length, you want to raise the button stand and the pockets and the waistline of the coat proportionally. So maybe if you're making a jacket, one inch difference, you might go a half inch difference at the waist. And that will be like a standard grade that like our custom designers knew of. So by using the computer, we could design the alteration. And I would say, Well, what happens when you shorten it just a quarter of an inch to use the you move the waistline an eighth of an inch then and the cousin of cutters would say no, because no one could see an eighth of an inch. But once the computer was designed to do the alteration the way we wanted, I found that it could do perfect alterations all the time. Because it doesn't care if it makes, you know, three more movements, even if they're down to a 32nd of an inch. So I really spent my early years like really getting to understand every possible alteration to patterns for the use of fitting and to. And we built this proprietary system. So that you know, when we measure somebody, and we say right, lower half an inch, like we know exactly how we're going to do that. And it's consistent. And it's done with a computer manipulation. It's started with a paper pattern. But you know, the advantage of the computer is that we can replicate that pattern exactly, if he wants a second suit. Or we could instill alterations into that. So whatever we do at a fitting, we can modify that pattern. So then we can achieve, we can achieve better results. And we lock in all those patterns. So and each one has its own pattern, we can print it out. So it's no different than a paper pattern except when someone has a paper pattern for a person and you want to make a change. You can't really add to it like it's very difficult to change that pattern in an appreciable way. We could jump from the one pattern to from a single breasted to a double breasted. It makes no difference because we're applying the same alterations. So again, we could have a pattern for a person, but it's really specific to a style pattern. So that person could have pleated pants or he could have flat from pants or he could have a very tapered pant. But he still, his body measurements don't really change. Unknown Speaker That's cool, very clever. takes all the guesswork out. Unknown Speaker We hate guesswork. PB Jay, I gotta ask is, Is your dad on board with the technology? Like, I'm just imagining myself in your shoes? And having this conversation with my dad, who was he fought computers, we're going to end the world like Skynet. So how does that relationship work? Unknown Speaker So that relation is a little tricky. But you know, on one end, my dad still to this day has never used the computer, just to give you. So that part was that but you know, as far as the use of technology in making clothing, like his expertise was on production and quality. So he was always at the frontline of like, Oh, everybody was trying to mechanize every clothing operation through the years. But he would see something and say, Okay, if this machine can do this job that makes this garment better than what it is today, then I can look at it. But just to make something faster and cheaper, which is what most of the technology is focused on. Like and usually to do it faster and cheaper, you eliminate a lot of the flexibility and capability. So it's a more of a machine that's going to sew something that a person used to typically, it does it in a very specific, controlled way. And then you can't go left or right. You can't go, you know, this fabric or that fabric. So it eliminates your capability. And it's only for speed, and you know, profit. And so that was never acceptable to him, but he was always open to something that could do something better. And we found that having the patterns on computer, we're way better than we could do by hand. So we still make the entire garment by hand. But you know, here, you know, we are to the 32nd of an inch, we can replicate it, we have a record of everything we do. And so it definitely improves our quality of suit. Unknown Speaker And what how many suits? Can you turn out in a given day or week? Unknown Speaker So it's changed over the years. But I would say about 100 is about what what our setup is right now. You know, and it depends on the workforce and the need at the time, but pretty much Unknown Speaker sorry, 100 in a single day, in a week or in a week. Okay. Oh, that makes Unknown Speaker custom garments. Gotcha. PB So, are you and your brother Todd, are you also cutting this? Did you take take on that skill from your dad at all? Unknown Speaker No. So we're not like, I'd say my skill is fabric, its style fit, measurement, pattern manipulation, quality, just knowledge of you know, what's the difference between clothing from the 1900s through today. Like I've had the luck of being able to work over the years with many of like, the top clothing designers and costume designers. And, you know, you learn so much each time from people who do it so much, and their viewpoints, but we're able to, you know, incorporate that into what we do and how we do it. My brother's skill coming in, like, I kind of fish my brother out like it took me a year or so after I was here. So my brother is about how things tick. He like understands the nuts and bolts of, you know, minutiae that nobody really could understand. So, tailoring at that time we were young, we come into a clothing business. And you know, if you ask a tailor, like you see he's sewing a certain kind of stitch in an armhole. And you ask, you know, well, why do you do this this way? And his answer was always, well, this is because this is what I was taught. Like, he could show you what he does, but nobody could really explain why they do what they do. My brother could look at it and say, Well, look, he's making these loose, flexible stitches around the armhole. And that arm, that sleeve is actually by those stitches, it's able to move and shift and when the person moves. So that's why you're using that kind of stitch there. And what's the kind of thread it has to be with and like, what's the, you know, there's a bridle on the lapel and, you know, it's made so that it has no give to it. It's not on a bias. And, you know, each step by step, Todd was able to dissect, like the 108 operations in the making of a jacket, and he could really understand what we were doing what other people were doing even He could be working for 20 years, but, you know, he could actually explain it to someone else. And, and focus on how it works and how, why it works. And, you know, in today's world, you know, it used to be any component you needed for a tailor garment, you pick up the phone, and an hour later, they were delivered at your doorstep here in Brooklyn. Now, there's very little clothing made in the whole country here. And ingredients, many times like you go to order something or we need something. It may be in China today, it may be in Germany, it may be in Italy, he's able to go search the world and find, you know, the right ingredients for based on the needs, even if we have to be inventive or industrious about, you know, the flexibility of how to do without sacrificing the quality of the garment. So my brothers involved very much in the making of the suits, and I'm more involved in the designing, fitting and selling of the suits. PB interested. And so I'm, I'm wanting to touch on films, and TV, and just going through the timeline of the family and the brand. When did the TV companies in the film, and costume designers start knocking on your door? Unknown Speaker Well, it probably knocked for a long time. So back in the days of 3g clothes, like, they were very involved in movies and television. And, you know, but it was through other retailers. So they would be the supplier. So if it was in Hollywood, like there were stores in California that we dealt with, and it would really be through the store that all this would happen. And so, and then my father, personally, he did not like the idea of working on movie or show clothing, he felt like it was always a rush. And he didn't like the rush, who says rushing is not good for quality, rushing is disruptive. Like, he always resisted it, unless it was like a really, you know, say like, Wall Street, the movie like that was one way back. Like it took like, Alan, it took like Alan Flusser, to come to him and say, Listen, we're working on this movie project, and we really need your help to get this done. And, you know, then he would, you know, in that case, entertain it. But at some point, you know, I looked at it after that as an opportunity. Like, I guess the first big show that came to us where it was going to involve a significant energy from us, was Boardwalk Empire. The costume designer John Donne came to meet with me. And, you know, he was trying to describe what was going to be entailed in this project. And he said, you know, without you can make the clothing, we really don't have a chance to do this. But it's going to involve like, every week, new scripts, new characters, and a lot of clothing. And we're going to have very little time to make each piece and we're going to have to make many of these pieces. So, you know, we kind of had to figure out how to not disrupt our normal clothing. But yet, you know, we only have one production line, the person who is asleep, so or so is all the sleeves, people who make the pockets make all the pockets, it goes step by step in a consistent way. But so I was able to figure out, Okay, I'm going to like measure every character. So it's not going to take anybody's time, but me, I'm going to do all the fittings, I'm going to write up all the orders. So just a question of like, as long as we're clear on like, these are the garments we need this week, and then communicating with my brother, my father, you know, going through the shop to really be on top of it, you know, we kind of made our own like movie line that would go through the shop. And, you know, also I came up with his, you know, breakthrough like my father always resisted rushes rushes were always a favor for a customer who was having a problem. And, you know, we don't like to, you know, we've always been my father's, you know, attitude is support for the retailer and the seller. So he would always do whatever he physically could do to help. But with the show, as I said, you know, maybe if we're going to do things faster, we have a right to charge more accordingly. Like the quicker they need something. It should cost more than a suit that takes us normally six to eight weeks to make. So we kind of came up or I came up with this idea that you know, the price was based on time and if they would give us a normal amount of time to make a suit you It really could be the same price as a normal suit that we make because there's no difference. I measure a person, what they like pick the right fabric, design it to fit them and the right style that they're looking for, and then do the fitting the alteration finish it deliver it, there's really no difference. It's just, you know, a 1920s suit, as opposed to a rag and bone suit, it took the same effort to make a pattern, that was something no one had ever seen before we make a new pattern, we could use the computer system to digitize and grade it. So like in a Boardwalk Empire, we worked on made like three standard models of the time, there were some that were like, more like elegant and like something that Nucky or, you know, the, or the politicians or, you know, diplomats would be wearing, we had another suit that was a little more like, not as refined, more gangster ish, but still fitted. And, you know, but it was something like the New York gangsters was where and then, you know, there were things that were more like guys on the street, or an FBI guy would have less shape and design to it. And we kind of made like, three boardwalk silhouettes as if they were new designs. And then, you know, based on the character was he A, B or C, and then, you know, to the point where, you know, John could just send me a person and fabric and say, just make it like this. And from the measurements, you know, we could dress him up accordingly. And, you know, it's we got to the point where to work together like that. Unknown Speaker That's so cool. Like, you were making clothes for Wall Street in like the late 80s, like through Alan Flusser. And even the costume designer, Alan Mirage didn't know there was. But, you know, until you guys started working directly with the costume designers like another 27 years, Unknown Speaker right. So you know what John taught, and then, you know, as it was more publicized of what we were doing, you know, one show, like, also, like our hesitation was we work with a store, you know, the store has another season, there's not like it doesn't end, you make clothing for a movie, it's like, oh, now the movie is over. So that clothing is never going to be made here again. But you know, we learned that but those costume designers go on to the next movie and the next show. And, you know, if they were if we created some great clothing together, then probably that becomes a forte of theirs. And the next show that they work on that needs clothing, I think it becomes a natural that we get a call and you know, this assistant goes that way. And this one goes to this show. And you know, before you know what we're working on 20 shows at the same time? PB And are you still doing the measurements with the principal actors? Or have you also kind of delegated if you? Unknown Speaker Well, rich, rich has been instrumental in helping with that as well. So, but that's basically between myself or rich, that's about as far as we let it. We like to have our hands on it. So sometimes there's nothing you can do. I mean, like, we've been flexible through COVID say, you know, I had to measure Robert Duvall for the movie, hustle, hustle. Yeah. They gave me a sketch of PB that jacket beamed out of the telly, when I was watching that movie. Unknown Speaker They gave us a sketch with his head superimposed on it of this 1970s Western style, you know, kind of suit with bell bottoms and all the stitching and details, but to measure him like he was in Virginia at the time, and it was COVID and we were in Brooklyn, so I had to figure out how to measure him over zoom. And I basically got his base measurements and you know then we sent a tape measure along with I picked out a jacket and a pant that I thought would be approximately his size just normal clothing and then you know walk them through put the tape around the chest and no no a little higher a little like Phil I could see that that chest measure was my chest measurement that I want it and you know, get the basic measurements of him and put the jacket on. I looked at all the parts of it like shoulders little too big but I knew what the jacket measured and then got the jacket back. So I basically just seeing the jacket you know the sleeves are too long. He stands a little forward he's a little he's low on the right side. You know I could get all these corrections made and then we made a mock up of the suit and sent it and then put that on him. And again, did the Zoom kind of fitting got it back then made the final garments and you know turned out pretty well. PB Yeah, fantastic. Well, the film was really good. Unknown Speaker Yeah. We were very surprised when they said that blue suit that you made for Robert Duvall, could you make the same suit for, you know, for? For Adam Sandler for Adam Sandler? Yeah. Yeah, so it's like we, so we did it to get his measurements. And that was another job. But we got that off of a different suit that was made for him for that movie or bought for him. So we kind of copied the fitted suit to make the blue suit for him as well. PB So can I know, whilst we're doing a bit of research for the interview, also wanted to touch on some of the precedents. So maybe we could shift gears and if we can get into some President territory, because I know that's a huge staple of your, your clientele. Part of it. So I mean, I think it was his dad that started with Eisenhower, like, I think he must have been, what 2223 When he will be tailoring him at that point. Unknown Speaker So the Eisenhower is, you know, it's a very a story dear to our hearts, you know, when my father was in concentration camp in book and Wald. So were without the American army coming there and liberating him at probably the last minute there in April of 1945. So, you know, when the American Army liberated them, Eisenhower came to the camp, and he actually met General Eisenhower or he was at that time, like an ADA lb, one of those stick figures that you saw, we've been working for over a year, and first Auschwitz and then book unwalled. And, like, Eisenhower was kind of like a god to my father who, you know, liberated him. And, you know, it was probably the motivation why he came to America when he was free and realized he had no more family, you know, left in Czechoslovakia. So he became an American here. And like, just by luck, the owners of the factory, the, the Goldman family had to had a relationship with the Eisenhower family. And soon as Eisenhower needed suits when he got out of the army, which was actually president of Columbia University first. That's when my father got, you know, take special care of these clothes, therefore, Eisenhower, and my father was like, so enamored with that he couldn't believe it. And he did take special care. And when Eisenhower got to be president, so my father was known to actually put certain notes inside his pockets, he sewed when he had messages for him. And, you know, at some point, the bosses called him in and said, you know, we know you've been sending notes to President Eisenhower in the suits, you've got to stop that. But it was my father's way of being my father. Oh, yeah. So that was the first kind of President and other Presidents we worked with through again, retail stores, where they would send the order if it was like a President Johnson, go come through through a store and Euston actually, and, you know, the first ones that he got directly involved with, I guess the Secret Service came to him to make bulletproof vests for President Ford at the time. There was more of a need for that, then, and had to put Kevlar into a vest that he could, you know, put under his normal suit. And then get personally he went to the White House for Clinton, many, you know, dress Clinton through his presidency. You know, there is, and, you know, at the time that was like, set up through Donna, Karen, we were making her custom and ready to wear, like, collection clothing for men. And she had been working with Hillary, and I guess that's how they asked my father to go and help with Bill. President Obama, I got more involved with directly. So I guess he was wearing heart chapter marks clothing, I guess, working and living in Chicago and supporting local business there. And at some point, I think he came across a Brioni suit, and realized how much nicer it was in quality and feel. And I guess the question was asked, isn't there somewhere in America that can make a suit like this? And they did a little research and I think the fashion editor of the Times, contacted us and next thing we know we were at the White House, you know, beginning to measure him So when we did that I did have the honor of going to the White House eight different times during his presidency. And, you know, we more or less made all of his clothing. Unknown Speaker I remember when that story came out and like 20 Han, I think that was the first time I heard of your father. And then it was just so cool. Have you had a president, inaccurate a sitting president come and visit the shop? In Brooklyn? Unknown Speaker Not a sitting president at the time. Unknown Speaker What would you have when you have had one come in after their turn? Unknown Speaker Well, like President Obama, we saw in New York City at his hotel after he was president, but not actually in the shop. Yet I don't think presidents ever attended here. Unknown Speaker I was wondering what the Secret Service had to come in and sweep in? Unknown Speaker Well, we've had we've had mayors and heads of state, you know, so like, Mayor Bloomberg, we dress all the time. And you know, when he was mayor, he security would come first. And yes, before he came, Unknown Speaker he drove very well. PB I mean, they must be they must have done presidents have like a lot of different tailors and a lot of different brands and a lot of different suits. They must they can't just have like one suit for Unknown Speaker me. I don't know. Like I think, you know, men are creatures of habit. Generally, they like what they're comfortable in. So I don't think men like to have like an assortment of all different things. I think they just, you know, want what they, you know, can possibly, you know, they just need several suits, if they find something that fits them that looks well on them. I think that's all they really want to be wearing. They don't want to be a different actor in a different show. I mean, when President Obama one day wore the tan suit, you know, it made quite like an astronomical reaction in the world. Unknown Speaker I hadn't thought you guys made that suit, didn't you? The chances? Unknown Speaker Yeah, and when he wore it like for, for an Easter celebration, or for a wedding in the summer, everybody, you know, loved it. But when he wore it at the press conference that day, people went crazy. Unknown Speaker Yeah, everybody forgot that Reagan and warranty. A lot a Unknown Speaker lot of people have, but it may have been for a purpose, because it wasn't like he couldn't have taken, you know, at that time he was going solid Navy solid charcoal more or less alternating suit every day. And, you know, he did have like a medium gray, a subtle stripe he could have chosen to wear that was different than those two, but he jumped to, you know, what he described to me as a tan campaign suit, summer suit? PB And what's it like actually in the room with the President? Is he on calls? You know, is he dealing? Is he doing some business in the background while you're measuring him? Or Unknown Speaker sometimes, you know, well, sometimes, you know, we have an appointment, but things come up. And we understand when we have to wait in the red room. It's not the worst place to be. But, you know, yes, sometimes it delays as things are happening. And that's just, that's the nature of the business for sure. But it's great. Like, it's certainly an honor, it was the first time i i was in the White House knows a nervous situation. I mean, I just, you know, you just want to do the best you can. And I had my dad with me that day. And he was, you know, more of a loose cannon, I would say so do it keeping him like to behave himself. And you know, getting everything done was, you know, a little nerve wracking the first time. Unknown Speaker And when you're dealing with somebody like Obama, is he picking out the fabrics personally, and then saying what he likes and the field? The Unknown Speaker answer is? Yes. I mean, it's just when we met with him, you know, there would also be an aide, his aide who helped with dressing and taking care of usually an ex Navy aide that always works. That's who managed the White House. And you know, he'd be helpful too, but basically, you know, we start with like, what are you interested in? And he goes, Well, I think I'd like a navy, a black and a gray suit to start. And no, I just felt the need to ask, well, what's the black suit for? I get the gray in the Navy. And, you know, he didn't really have a solid answer on that. And we thought maybe it could be a sport coat or, you know, it ended up like, you're right, I don't really need the black suit for now. Let's just do the, the gray and the Navy. And then, you know, years later, like, I think I was at the White House the night before there was a party with like Jay Z. And, you know, he brought up the black suit again, because by that time, he had tuxedos that we had made and you know, many options for almost any event, but then the black suit was one We then made the black suit. Clearly he needed it. PB It's interesting. I mean, go back, go back years of presence. You had JFK and Nixon during the televised speech and Nixon was wearing I think all black and JFK was wearing something a little bit easier on the eye. But because he was lost in the background, Nixon was like a wash because of what he was wearing this kind of real bad black faded suit. The ratings for him plummeted that time. I mean, it was like, also, when I think near enough, one of the first televised head to heads of prisons back in the day, so having something that like that, you were that obviously you're gonna have to project some kind of confidence but also stand out. So you can't just have like a right so Unknown Speaker so so helping President Obama select like, what is the Navy for a navy suit? So I came up with the idea of this loro Piana very fine, super 170s cloth that, you know, it did emulate like the type of cloth that Brioni was having. But, you know, we kind of picked out a shade of Navy, that wasn't midnight, it was a little bluer, so, and it had a nice sheen to the cloth. So when, when he stands out next to other people, you know, he does shine out in that suit, and it looks, you know, a little sharper, a little more interesting, with a little more blue in it, and the finish of the fabric. So it's rare that he would stand next to someone and be like, second, like he would definitely be the one shining. PB Yeah. Interesting. And so we could work. Well, going back to your dad. Jay, what is his role in the company now? Is he still coming in and overseeing? Unknown Speaker Does he know he's he's been retired for since COVID began. And he had really slowed down a little right before that. So he hasn't really been involved in the last four years at all. But you know, he's healthy. And he's my mom was enjoying her 24/7 time with him. And they have their routines. But, you know, he hasn't he threatens to come in and visit but he hasn't been a little while now. Unknown Speaker He's about 94. Now, Unknown Speaker do I have, like 94? Yes. PB Well, we often say on this show, like tailors and costume designers, what's it like to Taylor. I know, like the likes of Pierce Brosnan, where you might get starstruck, but I think for a lot of people coming into your, your establishment, it would be them, no matter how high up the ladder they are, in whatever film getting started over, you're dead? Unknown Speaker Well, I've found that like, you know, working with actors is really a pleasure, because most of them, you know, are thrilled that a custom suit is being made for them to play a part in something and it always enables them to be, you know, the character that they're going to play. And, you know, it takes into account their preferences. And, you know, I like like, put my hand in my pocket. This is how deep it should be, or, you know, different actors have like routines that the clothing becomes part of and, you know, working together, you can really like help them be whoever they want to be. And they're always super appreciative about it. So I kind of it's fun, and then it's so much fun to have it like immortalized that we can I can go in and see my clothing that I've made, you know, by just switching channels on the TV. It's pretty neat. So Unknown Speaker you do have some celebrity clients that are just buying, like suits personal rare, like I know you Taylor, Hanks and Conan O'Brien is my favorite have Unknown Speaker done in the past. Yes. Oh, yeah. So people are people so whether they're acting or living, you know, they they need clothing. So once you can fit them and understand their preferences, like, like a James Spader, you know, whether it's blacklist or James Spader himself, you know, it's you work with the costume designer and with him and it's, it's like, you're dealing with Jake, like, it's weird. Actors are sometimes like the costume designer is in charge of what they wear. They basically you're gonna wear this and look like this. And, you know, that's what we're gonna make. But sometimes when the actor is the producer, then he's more involved in the clothing being made for him. And like, it's fun with a James Spader, like he has like James Spader clothing preferences, where he's comfortable, and then there's red Reddington character, and, you know, the two are not necessarily the same, but if James Spader can't wear allowed stripe, then red Reddington can't either. Even though in the character for a gangster, it might be a possibility to wear a gangster stripe but, you know, the personality of the actor You know, precludes that? Yeah. Well, we PB we have that chat all the time about Daniel Craig and bond, because we know that he has a lot of his personal preferences with. And you know, the majority of them, I think he's knocked out of the park introducing the likes of Willie Reed and rag and bone, the aforementioned and stuff like that. But it does sometimes, you know, where do you draw the line between the actor and the character? Right. So Unknown Speaker I'm just thinking of one kind of clear example here. You did the kind of red suit for Joker, right? PB Yeah. Unknown Speaker Joaquin Phoenix. I mean, it's iconic now. And this is I assume you have to make a lot of copies of the Trek has been hit. Unknown Speaker Yeah, whatever. There's violence there. You know, multiples are needed. Yep. Unknown Speaker Yeah. What, what was it like working with Joaquin on that, and with the costume designer, and Unknown Speaker Mark, Mark Bridges was the designer. So he came to us first and you know, discuss this whole idea. And he said, You know, it's going to be a three piece suit. But it's not going to be like, three matching pieces, like, the style of the jacket won't match the style of the pant, or the style of the vest. And then, you know, here there was orange and red, there probably were four different shades, which through the show are intermixed and random multiples, too. But, you know, all the pants were the pant, regardless of the color and the same thing with the vest in the jacket. But so he gave us an idea for like the lapel of the jacket, a peak lapel and kind of a funny shape. And as we were making the first prototype, working off, like measurements we had for Joaquin at the time, like so we get the jacket ready, and we go, we're like, we're really rushing to get it ready. And we weren't really happy with the shape of the lapel, it didn't turn out the way we had planned it to be. So that was one thing we were saying, you know, all the dimensions, everything's right, but the lapel is a little off. So that's gonna have to be like fine tuned, going forward. And then he came in, and we did the first fitting here. And, you know, that was quite an experience because, I don't know, maybe he, you know, he becomes the character a little bit. So that was really an experience for one on to stare at him staring at the clothing in a mirror. But we put it on. They loved the lapel, the way it came out. And that became the lapel like there was no going to the one that we had planned. The one that we did like was perfect. Except he was like 30 pounds smaller than the measurements we made that first prototype of because he was losing weight apparently for the part. And like every time we made the next garment, he was smaller again and smaller PB majority will so he was emaciated. I've just remembered Yeah, we Unknown Speaker just have each time smaller, smaller, smaller until we finally got to where we need it to be. That's it. I'm Unknown Speaker wondering when you make something like that or say the costumes you worked on the Leonardo DiCaprio, Great Gatsby, too, right? Yeah. Yeah. Beautiful. Unknown Speaker We'd rather make clothing like this. Yes. Unknown Speaker Oh, I never heard that gauntlet come to That's gorgeous. Sorry, I got distracted. Many people coming to you after that learning that you've made these suits and asking for copies or something close to it. You Unknown Speaker know, from time to time? Yes. I mean, I remember this. Ryan Gosling, Crazy, Stupid Love. It was a green suit and some other things. And they were actually we did a small collaboration for some small store in LA. And that's where they got all the clothing from, but it all was ours. And that's what he wanted. That's PB a great scene. That's when he's walking Steve Carell through and just saying, We got to get that. We've been trying to cover that on the show. Can you seem crazy stupid? Unknown Speaker Oh, yeah, no, I remember this. Unknown Speaker So over the years, we've had like, I don't know, it must be 10 or 20 people have come to us having to have us make that green suit for them in their style. Kind of funny. And we do get people coming in that want, you know, a Nucky style suit from the 20s. Or, you know that there's definitely that that's actually from the 30s later in this in the show, but yes. That's okay. Unknown Speaker Well, was Boardwalk Empire or maybe, or Gatsby or you worked on Wolf of Wall Street? Was any of these? Are these all kind of comparable size productions? Is one, just one stand out in your mind as being incredibly well? Unknown Speaker Well, because like, you know, the movie is just a one time thing. Whereas like Boardwalk Empire was like six seasons, like just the pilot, like we worked for eight months on the one hour pie eyelet you know, we work directly with Scorsese on that. And, you know, so many they established all the characters. So it was really a ton of work. But, but that just kept going so and they had research and, you know, they really, that was so accurately depicted. It was great. PB And I know Lent we spoke to Leonard Lonsdale who I think did some suits as well, for overbooking. You kind of get on the whole to him and say, What are you up to over there? Are you doing the same style as we're doing? You know, for certain projects? No, no, I Unknown Speaker mean, this was a weird story for us, because I guess clothing. That was a credit clothing by Armani. And I guess so. But Armani, for some reason, could only make modern Armani clothing. So they don't have the ability to make a suit that looks like a suit in the 80s. That was an Armani style. So it was a little uncomfortable. But so whether him or us, I think, you know, we would invoice the show, and the show would like, somehow get the money from our money. So they could say it was clothing by our money. Oh, like if you look, it says on the show clothing by Armani. Yeah. But so, you know, we were we were contracted technically by Armani to make the clothing maybe, Unknown Speaker right, let's label it. But they were giving you patterns to work off of like, Unknown Speaker not we just we know the styles, but we worked with the costume designer to make what they liked. But, you know, it was clothing by Armani, if you've read the credits in the show, PB oh, Leonard has no luck with that. By the way. I know, when he did that, when we spoke about House of Gucci with him. He said that he got a little bit ill and couldn't quite make it to an Al Pacino appointment. And then you stepped in and did one suit and they got the credit right at the end of the film, made him mad as heck. Unknown Speaker So Great, Great Gatsby, they had a big contract with Brooks Brothers, clothing by Brooks Brothers. And, you know, so again, they asked us to send the invoice instead of to them to Brooks Brothers. And you know, we at the time, were making custom clothing for Brooks Brothers. And they had quite the reaction to that invoice, but they had to pay it. Unknown Speaker And it's some of the fabrics you used in Gatsby or even like the gozleme suit, the Joker suit they seem so they really stand out, you know, are these things that you just have, like bolts up in the factory are these things you have to sell? Unknown Speaker We work with all the major mills in England, Scotland, Italy, so many of these classic fabrics still exist and are being made today. was really interesting with Boardwalk Empire at the time, that's when television and things became high definition at that time. So if you looked at a fabric that someone was wearing, like at the time, the fashion was like, year round midweight fabrics. And, you know, everything was flat. But here looking at tweeds and flannels on high definition, you could really see the weave of the cloth and it was noticeably different. So these, you know, more antique looking fabrics of that time really stood out as different. They helped establish the style. PB This was fun. Kevin Bacon. Unknown Speaker More recently, city on a hill. Yes. This weekend, a year ago, year and a half ago. PB And did you go down to the set on that one or this one? Unknown Speaker We actually measured him. We were on the set. We were in his apartment in New York for a fitting he was here. He's been to. Yeah, so he's great. I think we do. Other other shows at the time. I think he was on also black mass. He was in? Oh yeah. We did a lot of people in that. And that wasn't particularly great clothing. It was like 70s Like, either you were an FBI guy, or you were crooked politician. Or you were a gangster. And I don't know, I think one of the costume designers themes was that, you know, everybody wore a blue blazer, whoever they were, and at some point, but, you know, once one guy was gonna be dead. Yep. So once one person was having custom clothing Natl big cast. So like somehow everybody had to have custom clothing and then the costume designer would say You know, it's custom, but it can't really look custom. So make it like it's an off the rack suit. But then as soon as you make a suit and the person is low on one shoulder, and you make it not low on that shoulder, so now there's wrinkles in the back of one shoulder, then you get feedback, like, oh, the suit has wrinkles on the shoulder. Like, they may not want custom clothing, but they do whether they know it or not, like, with John Donne, like the key was to fit the person, and then they could mess up the clothing if necessary to make it look, you know, old, worn or, you know, a little more inferior. PB So I'm thinking, and this is just a theory that came to me, but you were talking about the high definition earlier I have now I can see things a lot closer. And I'm convinced now that we've liked the likes of Boardwalk Empire and Peaky Blinders over here in the UK, that period piece clothing, in films, and TV shows, really draw people into tailoring and get people kind of infused again about, you know, wanting to wear something very smart and something, you know, something that's going to make them local or represent a character that they like, and emulate and show. And so does this kind of spring into your wheelhouse as well. Because I know you have had a history, like you're, you're talking about, you know, the history between the 1900s to present day, you know, this is this is really where you come to shine, I suppose. Unknown Speaker Yes. So, you know, we we really, like, let's see, I see a customer now, just new customer first time comes to us. You know, typically the person says something like, oh, I need a navy suit. So this is really no information for me at all. Because it's like, the first question is going to be well, what do you need the navy suit for? Like, when are you going to wear it? And to what? Or you're wearing it for work? But what is your work? Like? Who are you like what? So until I figure out? Like, it's not like, Oh, here's a navy suit? It's like, we have no idea. So we need to get to know who the person is, what he's trying to look like how he likes to dress. And then we can help them? You know, should it be conservative? Should it be more English cloth with a more matte finish? Should it be more of an Italian cloth with a little more sheen to it? Should it be more dress up? Should the you want to be the one that people look at when you walk in the room? Or do you want to come in and just like, not stand out in the room? Or, you know, is it something where you know, you're the star of that day and you want to really shine in it? Or do you like to show off? Like, you know, how fitted and how, you know, built you are? Or do you like it to be like understated or, you know, there's so much to it. So, you know, we get to know the person then we can make him? You know, it's like, what character are you You could be any character just because just measuring your body. And building a suit is like very, very simple in terms of, you know, sometimes they go just whatever you think, I don't know. But still, I could get the idea of like what he needs it for. And, you know, I can probably help a lot. But it's good to know the person a little PB Oh, do you get people coming in and saying I need a fake pot pocket to put my vitamin pills and like, Unknown Speaker limited to? You do? And you know, he was you know, he had to look presidential in that like? Yes. recovered, right. PB Yeah. Jay, I mean, it's been a real pleasure for myself. I know, Ken was talking about you guys way before I managed to get you on the line. So thanks so much for taking time out to speak to us absolute pleasure. I should mention also just in passing the book Measure of a Man, your father's book from Auschwitz via the President's tailor is available on Amazon, I'm sure have a decent book shops as well. I've actually just ordered it before we got on the line. So that'll be my next. Next Unknown Speaker very inspirational story. So it starts off a little rough, it ends pretty well. But, you know, it's like, it's a nice, it's not so, you know, it's the view of a very tough time and in the world through a 15 year olds eyes. And, you know, his impression of what he went through. And, you know, his mission that led him here and always it's about living and overcoming adversity. And, you know, like we're the last surviving, you know, union men's clothing factory in New York City. So it's the same kind of odds as similar odds. Unknown Speaker Yeah, I feel weird asking you about your father. I feel like I'm I feel like I'm treating it like Frank Sinatra, Jr. No, no, absolutely not. But I am curious because I've heard your your father in interviews talking about how wonderful it is that you and your brother have continued on the Do you know continue to run? Shop? Do you plan to keep the legacy going with? Well, Unknown Speaker we haven't made a formal announcement yet, but my son joined the company about three months ago. So David Greenfield is working with us, and we need the energy and the youth and to bring ourselves back more into the modern age more. So, you know, I changed the company a lot with my entry, and, you know, kind of tailored it to what I like to do, and the business go into that direction. But you know, now my son will have the flexibility to do the same. Unknown Speaker How can you possibly 3d scanning and virtual? Well, Unknown Speaker that stuff I've had a lot of experience with, and it has its limitations, but, you know, it's a social media, and it's just like, you know, most people still don't know who we are, that it's available to come up here and have a suit made? So there's a challenge in that. So we don't want to take over the world. We just want one customer at a time. Yeah, Unknown Speaker honestly. Like projects do that you guys have worked on. It's basically a film and television that you guys have played any role in. And it's fascinating. I feel like, I feel like there's a lot of untold stuff there. Unknown Speaker Yeah, I mean, we're certainly like, you know, we have the ability to, you know, be of help, like, you know, Nucky is cuff, like, I know, all the clothing possibilities. So it's like, how can we make him a little more special? You know, so this suggestions, and, you know, if you understand, you know, the storyline and what you're doing and the history of the clothing, you know, you can help so, you know, the character should be appropriate for what he's trying to be. PB Awesome. Well, Jay, we're gonna let you go. I think we've had you on the blow of an hour, your voice must be getting broke, but just head out. Greenfield suits on Instagram, it's a place to hang out. Also some great behind the scenes shots of people cutting the suits and the bolts and get out of Yeah, we Unknown Speaker have this you know, we have this 100 year old clothing factory here that's been in operation steadily and other than having to be shut down for COVID for a week until we figured out how to make masks and hospital gowns and brought our people in to make a find a way to do something useful. Other than that, 100 years of making clothing in this building very proud of that. PB And Ken will be down there tomorrow morning from anytime this was all the foreplay for Ken to come down by the way and C Unknown Speaker Sharp fabric user Obama. Unknown Speaker Do you know what that is? Yes. I'm not even kidding. Actually. Now I want it. PB Well, Greenfield flow view and stuff. Calm is also the place people can thanks for stopping on oceanographer as always and J. Been a pleasure and Unknown Speaker glad to be here. Take care. PB Thanks, Jess. Take care. Thank you. Transcribed by https://otter.ai